Paulownia Characteristics and Uses

Distinguishing Honey Locust and Black Locust

      They’re each stunning and beneficial woods — here is an prolonged dialogue on find out how to inform them aside. Could 11, 2005

Query

I simply lower up 600 bd ft of 8/Four honey locust. I can be beginning up my DH kiln tomorrow and was questioning concerning the SDR for the wooden. I am assuming it’s honey locust, not black locust. The logs measured 33″ in diameter and a lot of the slabs are 18″ to 22″ huge. The logs had been coated with AnchorSeal instantly after they had been felled about Four months in the past. They appear stunning… I do not need to spoil them in my kiln.

Discussion board Responses

(Sawing and Drying Discussion board)

From contributor C:

Honey locust is pink, black locust is yellow.


From the unique questioner:

Here’s a image of a pattern of the wooden I lower. Are you able to inform whether it is honey locust or black locust?


Click on right here for full dimension picture

The opposite facet:


Click on right here for full dimension picture

Pattern of the bark facet:


Click on right here for full dimension picture


From Gene Wengert, discussion board technical advisor:

Honey locust and black locust usually are not associated species… totally different genus. My vote based mostly on the image is black locust.


From the unique questioner:

Thanks. So it’s Robinia pseudoacacia. The fellows who lower it down weren’t certain which it was. Do you could have a suggestion on the SDR for black locust?


From contributor R:

Bark pictured is honey locust. 100% certain.


From the unique questioner:

I am getting confused! The bark pictured is from the wooden pictured, as properly. So it’s Gleditsia triacathos.


From contributor R:

To not confuse you extra, however the bark may very well be Kentucky espresso tree. The wooden matches additionally. It isn’t black locust.


From the unique questioner:

I’ve an enormous Kentucky espresso bean tree in my yard, so I do know it’s not a KCBT. The bark on the KC is extra connected than the bark on this locust tree.


From contributor D:

Did the tree have thorns on it? In that case, how huge had been the thorns? Honey locust has greater thorns.


From contributor L:

My vote is black locust. That’s proper about thorns. Honey locust thorns are three to six inches lengthy, whereas black locust thorns not very lengthy. In contrast to some individuals, I like sawing the stuff.


From contributor B:

Put me down for honey locust. Black locust bark is extra furrowed. Honey locust wooden is, properly, honey coloured. Black locust is gentle inexperienced at first, turning golden when uncovered to the solar.


From the unique questioner:

I did not see the tree earlier than it was lower, sadly. I will do a bit extra analysis and see if I can remedy the thriller.


From Gene Wengert, discussion board technical advisor:

Ship me a chunk of wooden concerning the dimension of a cigarette pack and I’ll remedy the thriller.


From the unique questioner:

Dr. Wengert, I’ll ship it out on Monday.


From contributor Ok:

It isn’t a espresso tree. That is black locust, Robinia pseudoacacia, often known as yellow locust. Given the scale of the board, it couldn’t presumably be clammy locust, which can also be within the Robinia household and inhabits a lot of the identical vary. The honey locust, Gleditsia triacanthos, has many extra thorns on the bark and the thorns rise up to eight” in clusters of three. The black locust has smaller thorns.


From contributor G:

I am undecided if that is honey locust or black locust. However I’ve had a number of honey locust logs milled, and never all honey locust has thorns on the trunk. There may be vital variation in thorns (some honeys are even naturally thornless), so I do not suppose the absence of thorns within the image essentially determines identification. From the image of the bark, my guess is that that is honey locust.


From contributor Ok:

The inclusions on the bark are deeper than the picture appears to point. I’ve sawn plenty of locust and I stand by my evaluation of black locust. What a part of the nation are you positioned? The diameter of the trunk is within the appropriate vary. Thornless trunks do happen, however often provided that particularly cultivated and really not often within the wild.


From contributor B:

Re: SDR for 8/Four Honey Locust Brad S. 12/5

I stay in upstate New York and have a number of honey locusts within the yard. There are not any thorns on the trunk and it in reality appears to be like identical to the picture within the unique submit.


From contributor Ok:

I nonetheless suppose it is black locust. The conventional vary for honey locust extends by means of Ohio into a few of Pennsylvania and all the way down to Texas. Black locust has been launched so far as Maine to California, as a consequence of helpful properties as fence posts (most of the fence posts on our farm had been put there by my nice grandfather 75 years in the past and are nonetheless intact). I’ve made Adirondack chairs from black locust and when you had been sunbathing exterior and a nuclear blast went off within the distance, your ashen determine can be silhouetted onto the nonetheless intact locust chair. Stuff is like metal as soon as dried and lasts simply as lengthy.


From contributor O:

Honey locust. A number of the bushes have thorns, and a easy bark virtually like cherry. Different varieties haven’t any thorns, just like the bark pictured. Wooden is unquestionably honey locust. I took about 2,000 bd. ft. off the farm a pair years in the past. Each sorts of bushes as properly – thorns, and no thorns.


From the unique questioner:

I’ve two samples on the way in which to Dr. Wengert. I checked Bruce Hoadley’s “Indentifying Wooden” p. 111. Black locust has many tyloses (p. 35), whereas honey locust has none. I am wanting on the finish grain lower with a really sharp LA block airplane, and with a 5x it appears to be like like honey locust.


From contributor Z:

Kudos to you for researching the wooden – I would guess good cash you’re appropriate. As others have mentioned, not all HL bushes have thorns. If you find yourself answerable for tree ID, it should throw you for a loop till you be taught this, wild HL included. A number of the mature HL’s bark will flip 90 levels to a ridge. This bark attribute is famous on the pic you supplied.


From contributor M:

Native honey locust (gleditsia tricanthos) has many spiny thorns, nonetheless most cultivars (cultivated varieties) are thornless. Many are generally planted all through the

U.S. When sawn up, the wooden appears to be like the identical as native spiny honey locust.


From contributor E:

I’m constructive that the highest image is honey locust. I’m in jap Iowa and honey locust appears to be far more widespread, not less than in my expertise. HL is a gorgeous wooden; the sapwood is a vibrant yellow and the center is gentle brown with swirls of darkish pink. I agree that many HL bushes would not have thorns on them, so you may’t at all times use that as an ID device. I might say the bark appears to be like proper for HL, however I’ve a really robust time with bark. BL appears to be like extra brown/grey when lower, and lacks the darkish pink streaks. Additionally, HL has a particular odor – it’s totally nice, however tough to explain. You possibly can inform black and honey locust from KCBT with fluorescence, the locust’s fluoresce vibrant yellow and I do not imagine KCBT fluoresces in any respect. (Am I remembering accurately, Dr. Gene?)


From contributor Ok:

Nicely, now we have narrowed it all the way down to a locust tree 🙂 I checked out a honey locust on our farm and the bark does appear to be the one within the picture, so I recant my earlier evaluation of black locust and go together with the honey locust.


From contributor X:

One of the simplest ways to establish the tree is from the leaves or fruit. Honey mesquite appears to be like loads like what you could have proven. Might be confused with honey locust.


From contributor U:

I personal river backside in Iowa and have extra scars from honey locust than I care to confess. Use the black gentle strategy. Honey locust will flip a gorgeous vibrant yellow. The sawdust may also stand out in your store and inform you how actually soiled it’s.


From contributor Q:

Yep, it is honey locust. We noticed a good quantity of it in central Iowa. On our farm now we have some which might be virtually utterly thornless and others which might be lined with ’em. It’s a a lot underappreciated wooden and grows like a weed right here. Those lined with thorns have a really distinctive sample I name cat prints on the wooden lower very near the bark.


From contributor J:

Since we’re on the subject, let me ask the locust specialists what I’m slicing. They’re undoubtedly locusts, the thorns are usually 4-6 inches lengthy, the bark appears to be like as pictured above, and the wooden is a really vibrant pink/peach shade when freshly sawn. Additionally, the bugs will flip it into mud very quickly if precautions usually are not taken. After I look across the internet, these lengthy thorned bushes are often (not all locations agree) referred to as honey locusts, however the wooden shade doesn’t match what is mostly described. I’ve lower many of those bushes, and the wooden is at all times a really vibrant pink/peach shade – similar to that of the Kentucky espresso tree when recent sawn. Anybody?


From contributor E:

Appears like honey locust to me. KCBT doesn’t have thorns, to the perfect of my data. These bugs can be the locust borer (Megacyllene robiniae); they’re black with yellow markings.


From contributor L:

Nicely, after a a lot nearer re-assessment, I’ve determined to vary my opinion. The bark is unquestionably honey locust, however the wooden is black locust. This can be a pretty widespread mutant in our space referred to as the black honey locust. The mutation was brought on by… higher not inform… they might nonetheless be round.


From Gene Wengert, discussion board technical advisor:

The wooden samples are honeylocust. You possibly can take this identification to the financial institution. (Right spelling of HL is one phrase.)


From contributor T:

Honeylocust that I’ve lower right here in northeast Kansas has heartwood that could be a salmon shade when recent lower. It turns extra brown because it dries (I’ve solely air dried it, although). Alternatively, Kentucky espresso tree that I’ve lower here’s a darkish chocolate brown when recent lower. It dries to a lightweight brown – concerning the shade of a chocolate milkshake. Each bushes develop very properly on this a part of Kansas, although not essentially to sizes helpful for lumber.


From contributor J:

Nicely, that is the place I’m, northeast Kansas, so I am certain we’re coping with the identical factor. I come throughout quite a lot of locust within the 18-24″ vary, which is sufficiently big for me, and such as you say, it is a vibrant salmon when recent lower. Since they’re a pest to the farmers round right here, they’re often completely happy to have me get them out of the way in which. I’ve burnt quite a lot of it for firewood, however solely simply began milling it. Any recommendations on maintaining the bugs from devouring it because it dries? I do not lower sufficient to warrant a kiln proper now, so I simply air dry every part, and the bugs appear to adore it. We do not have a lot Kentucky espresso tree round my place, however I’ve once more lower a bit useless standing for wooden.


From the unique questioner:

I’ve connected an image of a desk from which half is manufactured from Kentucky espresso tree. The wooden really got here from giant limbs lower off the tree. The tree is big; in all probability greater than 4′ in diameter. The KCT wooden is bordered by walnut. It’s completed with blonde shellac, so the true character of the wooden is revealed.


Click on right here for full dimension picture


From contributor T:

The issue with honeylocust and Kentucky right here is not the diameter of the tree a lot as the peak of the primary limb. Anyway, I’ve observed that the bugs just like the honeylocust, too. As soon as sawn and stickered, although, they do not get into it a lot. Extra exactly, as soon as the MC goes under some worth, they are not . I’ve had most of my issues with logs which have sat some time earlier than slicing.


From contributor J:

I am with ya on the limbs. In reality, quite a lot of the bushes I’ve lower have had a number of trunks, in all probability as a consequence of being lower off someday previously. They’re as unhealthy as hedge when you do not deal with the stumps it appears. Good data relating to the bugs. The items I used to be having actual issues with had been some thick slabs I had lower for a customized bookmatch desk mission. Fortunately, this girl mentioned she appreciated the holes within the wooden, and I feel I finally obtained the little suckers eradicated. Appears like subsequent time I might be higher off sawing it thinner, drying it quicker, then gluing it again collectively down the street.


The feedback under had been added after this Discussion board dialogue was archived as a Information Base article (add your remark).

Remark from contributor A:

I’ve plenty of black locust on my property and have taken the bushes all the way down to make wooden furnishings and keepsakes for the youngsters. I do know this wooden properly. The wooden pictured appears to be like nothing just like the black locust I work with. Black locust, when lower both quartersawn or flatsawn, exhibits a pleasant variation of yellows, blacks, browns, and greens. The wooden pictured is simply too monotonous to be actual black locust. I do not purchase it. The bark, too, appears to be like much less variegated than the black locust bark. Possibly it isn’t even honey locust.


Remark from contributor B:

I’ve labored with each honey locust and black locust bushes and the honey locust has a really robust odor when it’s lower moist. The black locust doesn’t emit a robust odor. The odor I detect is extra pronounced in honey locust wooden than in walnut.




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